Do you owe workers for ‘booting up’ time?
November 24, 2008 by Valerie HelmbreckPosted in: Budgets and spending, Communication, Compliance, IT employment, Special Report
Don’t be surprised if your organization gets hit with a new kind of lawsuit sometime soon. The latest legal challenge:
Some employees think they should be paid for the time they spend booting up their computer and shutting it down.
This might not seem like much to a salaried worker, but to an hourly employee who watches the clock carefully, it could be a big deal.
In the past year, several companies, including AT&T Inc., UnitedHealth Group Inc. and Cigna Corp., got socked with lawsuits from employees who say they weren’t paid for the 15- to 30-minute task of booting their computers at the beginning of the day and logging out before they leave
Add those minutes up over a week, and hourly employees can lose some serious coin, argues plaintiffs’ lawyer Mark Thierman, a Las Vegas solo practitioner who’s filed a handful of computer-booting lawsuits in recent years.
“These are hourly employees who are not making much more than minimum wage,” Thierman told the National Law Journal. “There’s a good half-hour a day that they’re not being paid for. It adds up.”
For example, let’s figure a call center worker spends a half hour a day on booting a PC up and shutting it down. The worker’s time is clocked automatically based on when they log into the company’s network and when they log out. The worker puts in five days a week and makes $15 a hour. Over the course of a week, that’s 2.5 hours of time in the office call center that the worker’s not getting paid for.
That’s $37.50 a week of being at work that’s unpaid and $150 a month the worker misses out on.
It’s also $150 the company saves by not paying the worker for that time. Spread that out over a call center with 50 employees, and the company stands to save — or lose — $7500 a month. Chicken feed? Maybe, maybe not.
But the attorneys’ fees to hang onto that amount will need to be factored into the equation if you get hit with a suit.
The big question in these suits depends on which perspective you believe. The attorneys who are bringing suit argue that workers generally spend the time waiting for their computer to boot or shut down engaged in work activities — organizing materials, doing paperwork, consulting their calendar.
Company lawyers say most employees use the time for nonwork activities, like getting a cup of coffee or going for a cigarette break.
Regardless, the suits keep on coming. You may want to check out these cases:
- In California, hundreds of customer service representatives at call centers are suing Cigna Corp., claiming they were denied pay for the time spent booting up computers before and logging out after their shifts at the call centers. Hazel v. Connecticut General Life Insurance Co., No. C08-03552 (N.D. Calif.).
- In Georgia, AT&T and BellSouth Corp. have also been hit with computer-booting claims, filed by sales consultants and associates who claim, among other things, that they were denied pay for time spent booting up and shutting down computers before and after their shifts. Brooks v. AT&T, No. 1:07-cv-3054 (N.D. Ga.).
- In Missouri, UnitedHealth Group also is battling a proposed collective action that claims it failed to pay employees who work from home for time spent booting up their computers. Wolfert v. UnitedHealth Group Inc., No. 4:08-cv-01643 (D. Mo.).
What’s your take on whether this time should or shouldn’t be paid for by the employer?
Tags: booting up, computer, lawsuit, pay, shutting down, time
November 25th, 2008 at 9:54 am
Maybe they should update their computers. 15-30 minutes to boot up a computer seems an awful long time to me.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:11 am
I agree with Char. I thought it seemed like an awfully long time to boot up. I used to work in several call centers, including Ameritech (now AT&T). When you got to your desk to “log-in” it was already at the novell server login so it only took 3-5 minutes to get up and running. I wonder if these lawsuits are more centered around those employees who start the boot up process and then go get their coffee and/or cigarette and don’t realize that it only took a few minutes and they could have been working for 10 minutes at that point. I’m a bit unsure about some of these lawsuits in general. I thought we had gone a bit beyond the “sue me” generation.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:15 am
Of course they should be paid. This is time given to a work related task. It is not personal time.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:21 am
I believe an employee should be paid for all time required for them to be at their jobsite. However, that doesn’t mean spending that 20-30 minutes playing around. That time should be used constructively. I also agree with Char. 15-30 minutes to boot up is a long time.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:23 am
Good point char…but I’m assuming it depends on the health of a system, the individual unit, the company’s network/server set up etc. I know my PC laptop that I use in the office takes a full 10 minutes to be fully operational — it’s a three year old Dell running Windows XP. To access the internet and intranet takes even longer. Logging off is even worse — the thing freezes on shut down and I have to force quit a number of apps that hang up.
Just a note: The iMac in my home office takes about two minutes to get up and running and about 30 seconds to shut down.
One other thing: An economic downturn is probably gonna be prime time for lawsuits. Big settlements will look plenty attractive to folks who think their job might be in jeopardy, don’t you think?
November 25th, 2008 at 10:47 am
We’ve been looking at a web-based time&attendance system – most offer the option (to the employer) of allowing employees to enter the time in/time out rather than tying it to the PC login. This thread has convinced me which option to choose – I absolutely believe that hourly employees should be paid for all time on the job, whether the tools are operational or not.
By the way, our networked office PCs, which are physically powered off at the power strip every night, also take 10-15 minutes from power-on to fully operational, even when users are available and responsive.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:56 am
This is part of risk management. Companies need to invest and maintain computer systems that have a minimal boot up requirement time. This might bring about a change back to dumb terminals. Hourly employees should be paid for boot up time if they are required to be at their work stations during boot up. Coffee, water, restroom, and cigarette breaks will be the next legal issue. In a equal pay for equal work environment these and more will surface like this one in the coming years.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:00 am
Yes, employees should be paid, but if it takes 15-30 minutes to boot their computer, something is wrong. I take my laptop home every night, which means that it has to synchronize with the system every time I boot or shut down, and it only takes about 5 minutes for the whole process, not to mention the clock-in procedure can be done before or during the synchronization. The shut-down process may take longer in the event that system updates need to be installed.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:04 am
It sounds like the IT department would be wise to consider something like Linux that boots faster. The incredible boot times of windows based systems is definitely costing productivity, and now cash.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:13 am
This is just more wasted time by people who want something for nothing! Since it seems like a good work ethic has been lost somewhere along the line, did they ever hear of doing well, giving it your all and striving to be the best; they will get noticed that way and in a good way, without dragging in lawyers, etc. Most employees I see have one finger on the button 15 minutes before it is time to leave. If your shift ends at 4:30, that means you do not stop working until 4:30! However I can show you hundreds of workplaces where employees have flames flying off their heels when the minute hand strikes! Logging in and out could sometimes drag…..for various reasons, however would they rather use a Pen and Paper all day? Do manual entries? Gee, it would only take seconds to throw the pen in a desk and leave. But, then they would find another reason to sue……it is crazy out there. If they have an issue, speak to someone in charge to resolve an issue. COWBOY UP PEOPLE.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:25 am
The log in/out times listed do seem excessive. However, I think suits like this would be unnecessary if employers would have recognized from the start that there are work-related activities occuring before and after employees are officially “on the clock.” If they would have instituted automatically adding 15 minutes time to each associate’s hour tally each day to account for this they wouldn’t be facing the potentially huge payout now. This sounds like an instance of employers being penny wise and pound foolish!
November 25th, 2008 at 11:27 am
I agree, 15 – 30 minutes seems like an awfully long time. I have slow computers that I manage and even those at my company only take about 5 minutes on the long side. Also, is it company policy that they would have to stay and “wait” for the computer to shut down. Once they log off, their done. Again, should not be 15 minutes. Walk away.
Now, I do agree that if you are at work, starting your work, you should get paid. Yes I would consider a computer booting up part of your “job”. Would you boot this computer on your free time? No. It is a work related function and if the company doesn’t want to flip the bill for computers that boot quickly or have them ready at a log in screen, then the employee should get paid for having to do this function. They should, however be doing such things as getting their “paperwork” in order for their daily duties.
I would think the call centers would have the computers ready when the employees come in. if not they could avoid the “boot up” time issue by simply having the computers set to do a timed boot up. This is in most all system bios settings. then all the employee is having to do is log in.
I still think the 15 – 30 minutes is bogus though. Are these anchient 486’s with 16mb of ram?????
November 25th, 2008 at 11:31 am
Employees are to be compensated for work performed. Employees should be required to be at their work site at the established time (meaning their desk or specific place). Logging into the network constitutes work necessary in the conduct of the employees duties. This should be part of their regularly scheduled day, not a prerequisite to start their shift.
I’ve come across many folks whose employer practices require them to be logged in when their shift starts. Bottom line is that use of the employer’s equipment to get ready for duty constitutes work. Many employers use archaic or slow systems that may take up to five minutes to boot up or shut down.
I agree that with the present economoc crisis, people should be grateful for having a job; however, this is not excuse for employers to
November 25th, 2008 at 11:45 am
I disagree that the times are excessive. Some computer networks take quite a while to boot up and arrive at the login screen. And irregardless of that, if I arrived in the building, then I am at work, because questions about the previous days work are brought up right away, someone has a problem that needs immediate attention, etc. The assumption that everyone is doing non-work related activities is incorrect. I don’t drink coffee and I don’t smoke, so every minute I am in the building, I am working in one capacity or another.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:25 pm
For a workstation to have any more than a 3 minute boot up sequence is a sure sign that the company in question is using archaic systems that are WAY behind in technology and are creating their own issues. As an IT specialist, I would never allow a system that slow on a network I support. If a system takes more than 90 seconds to get from power up to login, it has some serious flaw that needs immediate attention. It sounds like the reports from the hourly staff may be misleading at best however, if they are being instructed to ‘clock in’ via their computers, it’s pretty clear that these computers need to be awake and ready to go when the employee reaches the front door.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
The real issue here is not the actual boot up time. The real issue is whether or not employees should be paid for the time it takes to boot up.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:57 pm
One of the central issues seems to be “how long should a computer take to boot?” Personally, I feel that if it takes 15 minutes, there’s either something wrong with your computer or you’ve got too much junk in the startup routine. Good IT practices can fix this.
However, I understand that not all systems are the same and therein lies the dilemma with coming up with a fair resolution of this issue. If it goes to court enough times, which it definitely has the potential to do so, the lawyers (on both sides of the issue) are going to have a field day dragging this thing out because there are valid issues on both sides that will get argued endlessly. It will likely come down to “what constitutes a reasonable amount of time to boot a computer?” Some sort of “happy median” will be determined and then compensation decisions (or judgments) will be made on that basis. More than likely, if laws governing this thing get passed, it will NOT be fair to SOMEBODY which will lead to more litigation and so on and so forth… Wow! Something to look forward to huh?
It’s unfortunate we even have to bicker about something like this when our country faces much greater problems.
November 25th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
Either leave the computers on and log-in / log out time will be minimal. It also give IT the ability to do remote maintenance when their left on -OR- if electric costs are a concern, get power strips that can be timed to go on before the employee arrives, etc.
November 25th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
It is a known fact that on the average, employees work less than the eight hours they are paid on a daily basis; this is considering the time spent for getting coffee or drinking water, personal calls, chatting with other employees, extended breaks, smoking breaks, going to the restrooms, etc and to claim that employees are losing time for booting and closing their computers is utterly ridiculous.
I boot and close my desk top computer every day and it does not take me five minutes to do all of these.
November 25th, 2008 at 2:22 pm
Power up to log in is not what we’re timing, it’s power up to fully operational – most of that time is after initial log-in. And, waiting for shut down to complete so the power can be shut off is a security issue, as are many of the programs in the (amittedlylong) startup routine. That being said, I agree that what really matters is whether employees should be paid being at work, regardless of whether their equipment is operational or not. This doesn’t seem debatable to me – if they are at work, they get paid. My blue-collar neighbor does not clock out when the machine he operates is temporarily down. Doesn’t it seem like the time&attendance software could just be coded to add 15 minutes (or whatever is the norm at the specific workplace) before and after log in/log out?
November 25th, 2008 at 2:41 pm
So, where do you draw the line regarding being at work, vs. being ready to work? Is it fair to expect an employee who knows how long his/her workstation takes to boot, to wait for it to boot? Is s/he really ready until then? Is it fair to ask them to wait, unpaid, for a stoplight between home and work? Or to walk farther than their cube-neighbor from a large parking lot, or should they be paid once they arrive at the gate? Again, what of the employee who lives/drives further? Perhaps it’s only fair to start the pay period when they leave home? If good hygeine is required, then isn’t showering prior to work a requisite activity?
IMHO, they are being paid to work (a verb), not to necessarily wait for expected delays in getting to/preparinig for work.
November 25th, 2008 at 4:14 pm
I worked in a call center back in 1995. When I arrived at work, the computers were already up, all I had to do was enter my password to log in and I was ready to work – all of which took approximately 30 seconds. That was 13 years. If for some reason a station had not been turned on, it only took 5 minutes to start up. The company I worked for paid for this time but we had to be at our desk during this process, not getting coffee, smoking, etc. That’s the difference between being ready to work or simply being at work.
This is directly from the US DOL WHD: Hours Worked – Covered employees must be paid for all hours worked in a workweek. In general, “hours worked” includes all time an employee must be on duty, or on the employer’s premises or at any other prescribed place of work, from the beginning of the first principal activity of the work day to the end of the last principal work activity of the workday. Also included is any additional time the employee is allowed (i.e., suffered or permitted) to work.
If the employers don’t think that turning on your computer is a principal activity, I’d like to see their employees do their job by skipping it! The employees should definitely be paid for their boot up time.
I have one question though – don’t these employees have a definite time that they are supposed to be at work or do they show up whenever? I mean, if you have a group of employees that are supposed to be working at, say 8:00 a.m., but every single one of them is not on the clock until at least by 8:15, I’d say that’s a pretty good clue that it takes a while for the computers to start up.
Re: Doug’s response – are you an HR professional? If so, you would already know the answers to your questions.
November 25th, 2008 at 4:25 pm
It seems that most of you do not understand what happens at logon at most companies. Drive mappings, Printer mappings, logging, virus checks, file checks, time updates, registry entries,… If it takes 5 to 10 mintues to boot a networked workstation on a companies network, I wouldn’t be surprised. As to waiting until a workstation is logged off until walking away, that is nonsense. Once the initial logoff process is started and the prompt is passed, you cannot stop it. I can see where the logon process should be counted as on the clock but not the logoff. Do users clock out when they take a bathroom break or a coffee break or even when they stretch their legs?
November 26th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Other people have mentioned that the time it takes to boot up the computer is considered work time. Donna mentioned that their system could automatically add 15 minutes to their log-in and log-out times. Another option would be to install electronic time clocks. Most businesses now days have secured facilities, you need to have a swipe card to enter into the building. Install an electronic time clock just inside the security door, you use the same card to swipe in and swipe out when you leave. You can compare swipe in and log in times to see if employees are “milking” the clock. Counsel or discipline employees who are abusing the system, this is called managing, a function of management. The same issue has come up in factory settings, the time clock was positioned near their work station which was quite a distance from the locker room or front door. The employees won in those situations.
November 26th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
I’m not willing to ask my hourly employees to volunteer their time. There is sometimes a culture of entitlement in management that arrogantly assumes employees will donate their time because we are such great people to work for. It is also easy for salaried managers to lose touch with what it’s like to punch a clock.
That said, if any of the computers in our company took 10 minutes to boot, my phone would be ringing off the hook – not to whine about compensation (we use a free-standing time clock), but to complain that they can’t get their work started.
July 6th, 2009 at 11:12 am
The simple answer is for the time to be spent doing something else for the company. If the employee is too stupid to figure that out, a list of things to do during boot up should be provided. Clearly, these employees don’t have enough to do.
July 6th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
This is another clear example of management not understand their tasking. A good manager knows what their employees are doing and provides the necessary direction and training.
July 6th, 2009 at 2:02 pm
Sure thing Karl. If the employees are sitting in front of their computers for the sake of the job, then they need to be paid for that time.
My comment is that if the company is paying for that time, then more productive use should be made of it than having idiots staring at a black screen. I can’t stand the thought of people being paid for absolutely nothing in these times with so many people out of work and many of us multi-tasking to the point of exhaustion. Either find something productive for them to do during that time or replace them with self-starters who can find a way to be productive on their own.
Now I’d like someone to tell me how to deal with the employee who needs three or four 30 minute bathroom breaks a day. I”m afraid to ask what’s happening in there.
July 8th, 2009 at 2:13 pm
Doug – A company is not responsible for where an employee lives – that is a stupid analogy. However, a company is responsible when an employee is prevented from doing their job b/c a computer isn’t operational. If a company can’t provide adequate resources then they need to take responsibility and pay their employees properly. I am not hourly paid, but I deal with this situation every day. I waste a total of more than 2 weeks a year of my time not having access to a functional computer. I am, however, productive by doing paper work, proofing things, submitting bills to accounting….etc. This is nonsense. Oh, and I have a laptop that must be completely logged off and locked up before I leave. Therefore, I can’t just leave as it starts logging off – I have to wait.
July 8th, 2009 at 6:24 pm
As mentioned before this is clearly a management issue, or a lack of management issue. If you have hired employees that are as irresponsible as you describe, then you have poor hiring practices and policies. Maybe your company needs to train their managers how to hire quality employees. As far as multi-tasking goes, some of my poorest performers claim that are talented at multi-tasking. Problem being they can’t close out any tasks in a timely manner, and leave a mess for others to clean up after they fail. Self-starters often are promoted far beyond their competence and have poor teaching and management skills. Pointing the finger is clearly not the answer to this issue.
In considering break time you need to compile what is acceptable. This seems to be a novel management issue. If you can’t manage other people’s time, can you really manage your own? Whether it is getting a cup of coffee, a candy bar, a personal call, a cigarette break, a chat break, a short health walk, a face book break, or a bathroom break; what is acceptable? One group finds the other at fault as the other finds the first group at fault. Management defines the break time that is acceptable. Fairly enforces it, and all move along together to get the task at hand complete.
August 15th, 2009 at 10:55 am
I worked for one of the companies who was hit with a class action suit and settled. I can describe exactly what happened. These are production jobs. In order to adhere to your schedule you have to log into the time system at the exact time you are schedule and clock out at the exact time your break and shift are over. This company has 6 different programs that must be logged into in order to start taking calls. First you unlock your system, then open and log into each program and several of these programs have more than one log in and password screen due to security. We were “required” to be at our desk and logged into all of these systems before we could clock in to be paid. It did take at least 10 minutes if not 15 every day.
September 30th, 2009 at 1:28 pm
Our company knows how much time it takes for a computer to boot up so when an employee clocks in each morning, the time clock program automatically moves their clock in time to 7 minutes early.